STIHL.2489

Oh .. yah.. that.. well a bit back.. during the idea selling DLC, I made a note that people calling Mountgate P2W made me laugh... and you know.. people just HAD to disagree with me. .. and lo here we are. Which kinda answers your above question.

Yes.. I did notice that.. similarity between Wildstar and HoT. I also noticed Anet going "Oh kitten, we are sorry about that stupid Hardcore thing we tried, silly us,, here is a whole expansion of casual friendly stuff for you to enjoy called PoF, please forgive our stupid mistake" Cause they aren't developing pvp (2v2) new raids etc. And there where no negative reactions to pof absolutely. It's easy to miss the things you don't want to see I guess. Very true, I noticed a lot of people making complainants about PoF, in fact.. maybe more then fussed about HoT, but after HoT their numbers tanked like a lead balloon, and now after PoF the numbers are coming back, as such the people that loved HoT and hated PoF are not really their profit demographic. Sometimes you gotta pick your battles, and when it comes to MMO's, if you want to stay alive, you side with the people that are willing to pay for their hobby. Keep in mind, Casuals are not going to come to the forms in mass to make demands, they are casual simply because they do not have that kind of time to waste on a game, they will simply quietly stop playing and move on. Anet and many other developers would do well to understand that.

Cause they stopped developing Raids... PoF having more casual friend stuff to enjoy is arguable. Given you think "Housing" is casual content, it's not a discussion I would have with you about what is casual friendly content.

Glad you asked. See, the idea here is "Are Raids Profitable", which is a point regarding their access, and keeping them Niche content. The thing here is that Anet uses a system where they sell unrelated cosmetic items and various consumables/bank space in the store and then use the sales money from those items to fund development of other parts of the game. This making it so that is is very hard to track what retains players and keeps sales up. IE: It's near impossible to see what content is in fact profitable. Now I argued that this is the worst way to fund game development, if they sold additional content individually they would know what sells among their population and could focus on that. To understand this, they already have several existing dungeons in the core game of GW2, all linked to the Personal Story. These would remain free and part of the core game, then they would then make additional Dungeons and sell them Individually. if they sold well enough (IE: Self funded their own development) they would make and sell more of them. There was a bit of dissent on this topic and mu opponents brought up the outrage regarding Mount Skin, and the like (IE: Players don't like spending money. and wanty everything for free. imagine that).. but, if they sold content directly, they would not need to be as aggressive in how they sold cosmetics in the store, in fact, they could remove store cosmetics from the game overall, and just put them directly in the Content itself, so players could buy say a World Map, or a Dungeon, or Fractal Map, that unlocked a new skin for each mount, or a special custom weapon set, maybe a unique mask style, etc.. Thus making it so players had to play the game for their pretty items, and not just open their wallets. But.. you know.. if I said anything there are a whole group of people on this forum that would argue and disagree with me no matter what.

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. For some one asking others to refrain from lying often, the amount of stretching you do here to fit your agenda is insane. Mount skins were absolutely NOT called pay to win. Again.. you seem to forget, that I was there, yes they were, and for quite some time after as well. Reilly showed me how worthless the like P2W had become. in fact Mount gate killed any P2W cries for me. So it's your word against mine and most other peoples who have posted so far since we were "all there". Well that and the logical fallacy that mounts skins have any bearing on any type of "winning" as well as that the, by now remedied, rng acquisition method actually would make sense logically to have aggravated people. Given that some people have shown to have very tinted glasses in this discussion.. But just so we are clear, they did not change anything, they simply said, "We need to do this to make money,.. how would you like to be fleeced?" and after some consideration, they went with the High Dollar packs with Little to no RNG. Which is what Mount Skins are at now. and none of any of that is pay to win. I agree totally.. didn't stop people from calling it such tho. (Which was my whole point. in case you missed that) Which you have no yet in any way proven, not even by basic logic which I had pointed out. What did you say earlier? That's "the pot calling the kettle black" right there.This whole topic has been pots and kettles.. did you just get that now?

Yes.. I did notice that.. similarity between Wildstar and HoT. I also noticed Anet going "Oh shit, we are sorry about that stupid Hardcore thing we tried, silly us,, here is a whole expansion of casual friendly stuff for you to enjoy called PoF, please forgive our stupid mistake"

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. For some one asking others to refrain from lying often, the amount of stretching you do here to fit your agenda is insane. Mount skins were absolutely NOT called pay to win. Again.. you seem to forget, that I was there, yes they were, and for quite some time after as well. Reilly showed me how worthless the like P2W had become. in fact Mount gate killed any P2W cries for me. So it's your word against mine and most other peoples who have posted so far since we were "all there". Well that and the logical fallacy that mounts skins have any bearing on any type of "winning" as well as that the, by now remedied, rng acquisition method actually would make sense logically to have aggravated people. Given that some people have shown to have very tinted glasses in this discussion.. But just so we are clear, they did not change anything, they simply said, "We need to do this to make money,.. how would you like to be fleeced?" and after some consideration, they went with the High Dollar packs with Little to no RNG. Which is what Mount Skins are at now. and none of any of that is pay to win.I agree totally.. didn't stop people from calling it such tho. (Which was my whole point. in case you missed that)

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. For some one asking others to refrain from lying often, the amount of stretching you do here to fit your agenda is insane. Mount skins were absolutely NOT called pay to win. Again.. you seem to forget, that I was there, yes they were, and for quite some time after as well. Reilly showed me how worthless the like P2W had become. in fact Mount gate killed any P2W cries for me. Pics or it didn't happenGiven @maddoctor.2738 responses. pics don't work either.

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. For some one asking others to refrain from lying often, the amount of stretching you do here to fit your agenda is insane. Mount skins were absolutely NOT called pay to win. Again.. you seem to forget, that I was there, yes they were, and for quite some time after as well. Reilly showed me how worthless the like P2W had become. in fact Mount gate killed any P2W cries for me. So it's your word against mine and most other peoples who have posted so far since we were "all there". Well that and the logical fallacy that mounts skins have any bearing on any type of "winning" as well as that the, by now remedied, rng acquisition method actually would make sense logically to have aggravated people.Given that some people have shown to have very tinted glasses in this discussion.. But just so we are clear, they did not change anything, they simply said, "We need to do this to make money,.. how would you like to be fleeced?" and after some consideration, they went with the High Dollar packs with Little to no RNG. Which is what Mount Skins are at now.

I don't see anything in there about marketing the game for hardcore players and raids. So try again. Just so we are clear.. You missed this under the first link: When I said " "You totally did not see the: Well if you missed that, I don't see a point in trying again, since you turned a total blind eye to what you were given.

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. For some one asking others to refrain from lying often, the amount of stretching you do here to fit your agenda is insane. Mount skins were absolutely NOT called pay to win. Again.. you seem to forget, that I was there, yes they were, and for quite some time after as well. Reilly showed me how worthless the like P2W had become. in fact Mount gate killed any P2W cries for me.

For example, Wildstar had some of the best housing system in an mmorpg. I guess that so much asked for casual feature didn't save the game :( Nope.. not at all. Giving a bunch of pointless grind content o players that you treat like second class citizens while you dolt upon your raiders the best stuff ever, is not going to endear casuals to your game. This is a lesson GW2 should pay attention to as well, when it thinks it's putting out "Casual" content. .I hope my My point is made... but even if I posted other links, I going to guess you will just stick you head in the sand and ignore all that.. because it does not agree with what you want to be true. I can't find too many links.. because you know.. the game that was marketed as Hardcore died.. so they took down their own links. But you know.. it was common knowledge that it was a hardcore's game. The fact that you are even questioning this is laughable. And the fact that you think a "House" is casual.. is insulting. I mean like, really, dude, can you show you have no idea what a casual even is when you say things like "Oh it has housing it must be for casuals" like What.. really.. hardcore players don't use housing? Painfully laughable.

This is so wrong it;s not even funny.. Not only did they call the Mount Skins P2W, you make it seem like this game didn't have BLC in the game since the start (Which are directly loot boxes, and that is just stating the obvious), Black Lion Weapon Skins, anyone? Not to mention that a vast number of other purely cosmetic stuff in the store is also sold in RNG Loot Box Style, which have been a staple since the Start like Dye Packs, Minis, etc. So, again the ridiculousness of Mount Gate, will never be lost on me, because mount skins were just like the other existing RNG of the Store... and yes.. they called it P2W, I think I i have seen them still cal it P2W. I laughed myself to the high heavens over that, the absurdity of it was hilarious, I still can't help but to laugh now. Just like now, people thinking that Raids would self fund when another of NcSofts games, Wildstar, which was marketed as a Hardcore raid game, just shut down. Truth is, hard content does not sell, that is why Riaders in this game need casuals to fund their content. Honestly, I think players would rather just buy more of the content they want to play, then deal with buying cosmetics and seeing their money go into developing content they will never touch and might even hate. In fact if they took this approach, WvW might get the Dev Time is so desperately needs.

Edit:Maybe it's the language barrier since I'm not a native english speaker. I'll try it again: Raids are the content that are keeping me playing the game. Without raids I wouldn't be here and I wouldn't be spending any amount of money. Again, let me break this down for you. You left after raids came out, Raids had been a part of this game when you chose to leave, and you chose to leave because you could not make progress doing raids. You did not go out and join a Raid training guild (Which were already available by the end of the first month Raids went live, if not sooner, so you left after they were available)You did not find a new static group to run with because you loved the content and wanted to do it.You did not try to Pug your way into getting good at raids, or even start your own LFM's. In short you did none of the things that raiders tell other people to do to get into raids. You Left the game. As Irony would have it.. you left because you could not do raids. Well, I am sure you were not alone in that, but I am going to wager there were a lot more people that didn't have a circle of friends to be there for them to return to. Truth is, if your friends had not come back to work with you and walk with you though raids you never would have come back, , and by your own admission not being able to do raids would have been the very reason why you left. The Irony will never escape me. You are living proof they should have put in an easy mode, for all he players like you that want to do raids, but unlike you, don't have an existing group of friends to walk them through the content. When you wonder if people have left over not being able to do raids.. well.. you left. Great discussion. Thanks for being the living embodiment of my point and stand, even if you will never admit it.

People can see the truth.. and not accept it. But I stand by what I said, if Raids were profitable standalone, games like Wildstar would not have shut down. As I said before they are a dinosaur of the past, something that should have gone away with Kill Stealing, and Ninja Looting, and are about as welcome in modern MMO's as either of those things. Raids are simply not good content, they do not build community, they do not foster a better gaming community, they divide the game into raiders and non-raiders, and this is simply not a good thing for an MMO. They might work if they were made more inclusive like Fractals, bit, in their current set up, they will not profit this game, not in any means.